Too small for cricket and passed over by rugby, the stadiums that cost South Africa more than $1bn for this year’s World Cup already appear to be turning into white elephants.
Associated Press
Both rugby and cricket are more commercially successful than football in South Africa, and both sports need to move into the new stadiums – built and renovated for Africa’s first World Cup – to keep them alive financially.
On Tuesday, South African Rugby Union president Oregan Hoskins told members of parliament in Cape Town that there had been no discussions between Durban city officials and rugby representatives before the $400m, 70 000-capacity Moses Mabhida Stadium was built, and now it did not have enough suites to accommodate the local Sharks rugby team’s suite holders.
Hoskins said that the Sharks, who compete in the annual Super Rugby competition and the domestic Currie Cup and could offer near year-round use, would have a “massive problem” to move to the new stadium.
“What we are discussing today should have been discussed before we built the stadiums,” Hoskins said. “It is tragic for us as a nation that we have to act in reverse.”
The situation in Cape Town is just as bad, according to Hoskins, because of the deteriorating relationship between the local Western Province rugby union and the Green Point Stadium operators.
The South African Press Association quoted Western Province Rugby president Tobie Titus as saying that on the advice of an independent financial adviser, Western Province Rugby was staying at its current stadium, Newlands.
So the iconic Green Point Stadium [RW: Officially named the Cape Town Stadium], set in the shadow of the famous Table Mountain, could now be rarely used and is set to cost more than $6m a year just to maintain.
Cricket South Africa chief executive Gerald Majola added that the pitches at the stadiums were too small to host cricket games, and blamed this on the failure of cities to consult cricket authorities before construction.
Hoskins said the hype generated by the recent World Cup also hid many of the issues, leaving the stadiums now struggling to bring in income.
“In 2007, before the new stadiums were built, I wrote to the minister of sport and said I foresaw major problems coming and I asked for the intervention of the ministry,” Hoskins told the committee. “Unfortunately, we were all taken up by the soccer World Cup and in the hype we forgot we should have been talking to each other.”
In July, South African Football Association chief executive Leslie Sedibe conceded to the same parliamentary committee that football faced a major challenge to keep the stadiums in use and profitable – largely due to traditionally low ticket prices charged at local matches and the high cost of running the world class arenas.
Sedibe’s observation came just 10 days after the World Cup ended, and after South Africa spent an estimated $1.3bn building and upgrading the 10 stadiums used for the tournament.
It was hoped rugby and cricket would help out.
But, even as the world champion South African rugby team prepares to play its first international at the 94 000-seat FNB Stadium (ex-Soccer City) in Johannesburg, the venue for the World Cup final, the assessments of Hoskins and Majola paint a bleak picture for the stadiums’ long-term future.
Majola said Cricket South Africa had been forced to seek special permission from the International Cricket Council to host a Twenty20 game between South Africa and India at the Moses Mabhida Stadium early next year, but it was a one-off and the playing surface was still too small for major games.
He also pointed to a lost opportunity for cricket to move to World Cup stadiums in the northern cities of Rustenburg, Polokwane and Nelspruit, which are likely to struggle because of their remote locations and lack of major sporting teams nearby.
“Historically, our game had not been played in some of the areas where some of stadiums were built,” Majola said. “We saw an opportunity, but unfortunately we were not part of the designs of the stadiums.
“Unfortunately, we are compelled by the size of fields. When these fields were built, we were not part of that.”
Majola said if the stadiums had been suitable, CSA could have made space for an annual tournament like the popular Indian Premier League.
In his brutally honest assessment, Hoskins said all the problems threatened to make South Africa “a laughing stock.”
“We want to use the new stadiums,” Hoskins said. “We want to take the game to the people, but these issues are going to stand in our way in a big way.”
August 18th, 2010 at 11:14 pm
Hoskins, to be fair, actually sounds like he knows exactly what he’s talking about, and I couldn’t often say that about him.
http://fromthebottomoftheruck.blogspot.com/
August 19th, 2010 at 2:44 am
What’s new?
Ellis Park has been a white elephant for years now?
August 19th, 2010 at 2:46 am
The Sharks and the WP have a great opportunity to score new stadiums, practically free of charge.
They just need to be clever about it.
August 19th, 2010 at 2:47 am
Free State Stadium was not even full during the soccer.
Another white elephant.
August 19th, 2010 at 6:07 am
What a joke… to all but those BEE cats that got the tenders!
August 19th, 2010 at 7:16 am
And to think Durban City council for months pre and during the build were threatening to force the Sharks to move… you’d think these brainless fools would have at least got the suite-holder capacities correct…
They don’t have a leg to stand on…
Off topic… for all your Firefox users (and you all should be by now)… Google and Firefox have warned that Voldy has been hacked by ‘badware’ players and you should not access the site until clear… lol!
August 19th, 2010 at 11:15 am
Heheheheheheh
Well everyone who warned them beforehand this would happen were racists and naysayers (my brother in law was one of those and I know he reads RW…. told you so didn’t I)
But niow that the shouted down words of these naysayers (myself included) have come to pas…. everyone pretedns nobody said a word about it.
Natal Stadium is owned by Sharks so why move?
Newlands the same thing… and as a matter of interest a “birdie” whistled to me that the Newlands Stadium as an abandoned stadium is pretty much worthless without the attached contracts of teams to play there… as a home ground.
As I predicted beforehand…. these stadiums will just serve as places for ANC to hold rallies for ever dwindling numbers of “rent an ANC t-shirt wearing supporter crowd” and eventually fall into disrepair.
August 19th, 2010 at 11:23 am
Reply to DavidS @ 11:15 am:
I thought the naysayers where those that said the stadiums would not be ready in time and that there was no way SA could host a successful SWC.
Those that said some of the stadiums would not be used after the SWC where just realists.
That said adding some suites to a stadium is big sweat, relatively speaking. Changing the size of the pitch area is a slightly bigger undertaking.
Badly thought out.
August 19th, 2010 at 11:24 am
Oops, should read
That said adding some suites to a stadium is NO big sweat
August 19th, 2010 at 11:45 am
Yep, the remnants of a WC.
The success (profitability) of a WC/Olympics is not determined on the cash generated during the event, but how the infrastucture can be utilised or sustained after the event.
It is very difficult for a small country to effectively utilise and maintain these 1st world infrastructure.
However, I agree, better planning could have ensured that some of the issues raised above would have been better addressed.
That said, I thoroughly enjoyed the WC!
August 19th, 2010 at 12:04 pm
Only reason that Majola was pee’ed off with the fact that he was not part of the pre-staidum discussions, was that he missed out from some more “bonus” payments…
August 19th, 2010 at 12:07 pm
First of them is SAIL.
Sail – has with the advice and promise that he would broker the deal to get WP to the Cape Town stadium appointed Morne du Plessis to run the stadium on behalf of the Cape Town Munisipality. Du Plessis again brought in his mates from Stade Francais – why – nobody knows.
Sail is stuck with this management agreement for 10years..
Sail – on the other hand is also a BIG Shareholder in WP Rugby – which initially seemed to be the one thing which might help move WP Rugby to Cape Town Stadium.
The question at hand though, what will happen with Newlands without WP Rugby as the value is in the stadium, the suites and the team.
To answer this question – we need to put a value on Newlands, without Rugby and everything around that. This is where they realized the mistake, from both sides.
The REAL value of Newlands is:
The value of the land per Square meter – less the demolition cost.
Which all of a sudden is not a much as they anticipated and makes it close to impossible for WP Rugby to leave Newlands.
On the flip side:
Cape Town Municipality has also fluffed up. They should be the ones who can make the deal sweet…by offering WP something that they can not refuse, as a goodwill gesture to the rate payers and all those who are now paying for a monster nobody really wanted.
So let see what happens next.
August 19th, 2010 at 12:08 pm
With regards to the Cape Town Stadium and Newlands situation.
We have a number of role players and issues here at hand.
First of them is SAIL.
Sail – has with the advice and promise that he would broker the deal to get WP to the Cape Town stadium appointed Morne du Plessis to run the stadium on behalf of the Cape Town Munisipality. Du Plessis again brought in his mates from Stade Francais – why – nobody knows.
Sail is stuck with this management agreement for 10years..
Sail – on the other hand is also a BIG Shareholder in WP Rugby – which initially seemed to be the one thing which might help move WP Rugby to Cape Town Stadium.
The question at hand though, what will happen with Newlands without WP Rugby as the value is in the stadium, the suites and the team.
To answer this question – we need to put a value on Newlands, without Rugby and everything around that. This is where they realized the mistake, from both sides.
The REAL value of Newlands is:
The value of the land per Square meter – less the demolition cost.
Which all of a sudden is not a much as they anticipated and makes it close to impossible for WP Rugby to leave Newlands.
On the flip side:
Cape Town Municipality has also fluffed up. They should be the ones who can make the deal sweet…by offering WP something that they can not refuse, as a goodwill gesture to the rate payers and all those who are now paying for a monster nobody really wanted.
So let see what happens next.
August 19th, 2010 at 12:23 pm
i have been told by someone within WP rugby that they intend to hang on for five or so years before doing anything about Cape Town Stadium…
if they made ANY deal now it would be a ‘charitable’ deal aimed at assisting CTS and would be financially disastrous for WP Ltd.
if they wait for the lease-holders to rack up the debts for a few years the negotiations will be far more business-like and WP will be doing so from a position of strength and strike a far more meaningful and financially sound deal…
August 19th, 2010 at 12:28 pm
Tut tut tut…
Who did that headline, sies, but the journo also used the wrong PC term :
dis ‘voorheen bevoordeelde olifante’, ons moet hier mos die demografie in ag neem!
August 19th, 2010 at 12:49 pm
Reply to Ollie @ 11:23 am:
Perhaps being in Belgium you were not paying proper attention…
The “stadiums not ready” thing died in the ConFed Cup 2009…. when… surprise surprise the satdiums were ready… but only because FIFA arranged to have uropean contractors do the work.
Maybe you should rather not do some thinking for a while because whenever you ask questions that arrive from “I thougt… or “I think…” from you they are invariably not intelligent…
Maybe if you talk instinctually and less questioningly more sense occurs…
August 19th, 2010 at 1:15 pm
Previously advantaged elephants
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
August 19th, 2010 at 1:41 pm
Reply to DavidS @ 12:49 pm:
no no, there were plenty of people saying that the stadiums would not be ready and that transport would never be able to handle the flow of people etc. for the SWC.
The fact that outside contractors had to be brought in is entirely irrelevant as it shows that the situation was adapted to and the job done on time.
I don’t think that one, I know that.
And I us the words think and thought often because I have no proof of something so I don’t try and sell BS off as fact, like others might try and do.
August 19th, 2010 at 1:55 pm
Reply to PietPloos @ 12:08 pm:
What typically happens here is that the city or the state build the stadium and gets revenue from the parking lots and events.
The football team gets to use the stadium for free and all the revenue from ticket sales and concessions.
When the stadium gets old and decrepit the team threatens to move unless the city build them a new one.
WP should take a similar approach. Offer the city Newlands in exchange for free use of the new stadium. WP rugby revenues will benefit from the increased capacity and the city and Sail can try to recoup their losses via rock concerts and might men conventions. Or maybe even when they get the Olympics.
August 19th, 2010 at 2:03 pm
PietPloos, you forget 1 thing: Sail (read: Morne) was not that stupid! They have signed an agreement with City of Cape Town that will GUARANTEE them not only income, but actually a PROFIT (even if NOTHING happens at the stadium). SO: the only people screwed here are all the ratepayers in CT metropole, who’s rates will also include a levy for SAIL in future.
Nice, ain’t it??? Who cares about accountability….
My guess is that this did not happen in Durban, and that’s why the City of Durban are using all their ANC buddies to stir this issue, to somehow get somebody else to blame.
August 19th, 2010 at 2:46 pm
Reply to DavidS @ 12:49 pm:
Reply to Ollie @ 1:41 pm:
March 18, 2010
FACT, work on stadiums were not complete and there was concern about it
http://edition.cnn.com/2010/SPORT/football/03/04/football.jordaan.africa.stadiums/index.html
Confed cup ended late June 2009, article dated 18 July 2009:
FACT, work on stadiums were not complete and there was concern about it
http://edition.cnn.com/2010/SPORT/football/03/04/football.jordaan.africa.stadiums/index.html
Naysayers jumped on these articles shirt tails and had a whale of a time.
So here,have a banana
August 19th, 2010 at 9:27 pm
Reply to Ollie @ 2:46 pm:
In Jun 2009 the only stadium in SA reported as not yet ready was PE
CNN is not a reliable news source about South Africa
August 20th, 2010 at 4:18 am
Reply to Ollie @ 2:46 pm:
The biggest concern for most ‘naysayers’ was that the stadiums would become white elephants afterwards, with BEE contractors the only benefactors… and all those billions of dollars wasted when in this third world country people are still living in tin shacks!
As it goes over 70 schools and thousands of RDP homes could not be built during this period as there was NO cement available in the entire country!
Again the ‘naysayers’ have been spot on!
But then lefties like you were simply ‘holding thumbs’ instead of using logic!
August 20th, 2010 at 7:32 am
WP considers move to Cape Town Stadium
Western Province Rugby on Thursday said it may be moving to the new Cape Town Stadium after all, despite the relocation originally being ruled out by rugby bosses.
The move from Newlands to Green Point was initially rejected due to high rental rates and potential losses of revenue from hospitality suites.
The suites at Newlands outnumber similar facilities at Cape Town Stadium.
Western Province Rugby CEO Theuns Roodtman said they are likely to meet with the City of Cape Town next week.
He said, “There will be a meeting very shortly…Dave Hugo of the city approached us yesterday and was in the meeting with us. We will meet…to discuss the way forward and see where we can take hands and where we can carry forward.”
Roodtman said even if an agreement is reached between Western Province Rugby and the city, it is still not a given that they will move.
“Our decision isn’t one of Theuns Roodtman or Toby Titus taking it. Our decision is…a democratic motion that is put to 90 clubs who own the stadium and two schools, unions and the referees’ society must make that decision.”
http://www.eyewitnessnews.co.za/articleprog.aspx?id=46726
And also reading WTR is that it is just a matter finalizing the contract for the Lions move over to FNB Stadium…
August 20th, 2010 at 8:52 am
Reply to DavidS @ 9:27 pm:
And Nelspruit apparently:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/feb/28/world-cup-stadium-south-africa
And a race against time for Soccer City:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/international/article7038427.ece
Reply to bryce_in_oz @ 4:18 am:
Actually Bryce I was saying that the stadiums would be ready and SA would hold a successful WC but that they would have a problem after the SWC.
So careful when you try and paint all people who disagree with you at some time or the other with the same brush.
But I have said enough on this.
Too much
and not enough banana’s
August 20th, 2010 at 9:23 am
Yup for too much of a lack of brains and too much opinions…
August 20th, 2010 at 9:31 am
Reply to DavidS @ 9:23 am:
hehehehe
we really need a pot/kettle/black emoticon
August 20th, 2010 at 9:44 am
Reply to Ollie @ 8:52 am:
Argument, questioning, pondering, is good… ignorance not…
August 20th, 2010 at 9:46 am
Reply to bryce_in_oz @ 9:44 am:
of course…
August 20th, 2010 at 10:04 am
Reply to bryce_in_oz @ 9:44 am:
Ok, let me get this straight.
- I pass a comment saying that I though the naysayer about the SWC where the one that said the stadiums would not be ready and SA could not host a successful SWC. And, that those who said the stadiums wold be white elephants thereafter were realists.
- Dawie says that the stadiums not ready thing died down in the Confed cup. Only PE stadium was feared to possibly be not ready. And spews some other insults
- I post some links to articles from after the Confed cup still raising issues about stadiums not being ready, including Soccer City and Nelspruit aside from PE
- Dawie says CNN is not reliable
- I post another article from another source
- You point out that the naysayer were actually concerned about after the SWC. And, that I am a leftist who doesn’t use logic.
- I say that I always thought that the stadiums would be ready, but that afterwards there would be problems. Thereby you pointing me out as a leftist is actually incorrect
- You post bryce_in_oz @ 9:44 am:
So please explain what you mean. As I supplied facts regarding the concern of stadiums not being ready to support.
Or maybe you refer to the ignorance being to what a naysayer actually is. If so, fair enough. Then we misunderstood each other.
August 20th, 2010 at 10:12 am
Reply to Ollie @ 10:04 am:
I’m well over
repetition with ‘The Emperors New Clothes’ mob…