Five members of the Springbok squad that returned from New Zealand on Monday have been released to their provinces to play in the Absa Currie Cup this weekend.
The released players were all part of the 28-man squad that played Australia and New Zealand on consecutive weekends in The Castle Rugby Championship, but were not part of the match 22 that faced the All Blacks in Dunedin on Saturday.
They are Craig Burden (The Sharks), Frans Malherbe (DHL Western Province), Jacques Potgieter (Vodacom Blue Bulls), Jano Vermaak (Vodacom Blue Bulls) and Lwazi Mvovo (The Sharks).
The sixth player that was not part of the match 22 in Dunedin, Pat Cilliers (MTN Golden Lions), is currently injured and not available for selection this weekend.
A Springbok squad of 30 players for the final two Tests in The Castle Rugby Championship – on September 29 against Australia at Loftus Versfeld and on October 6 against New Zealand at Soccer City – will be announced at the conclusion of round seven of the Absa Currie Cup Premier Division on Saturday evening.
The squad will convene in Johannesburg on Sunday evening to start preparations for the Tests against Australia and New Zealand.
elcamino
logan
ROOILEEU
Tina
KingPaul
Methos The French Stormer
Thomas_Bulls
Deon
Aldo
garyj1-Bulls
JT_BOKBEFOK!
Amethyst
trevormayhew
Pom in Joburg
Marcel
namboer
RUGGA_MIND
Jacques(Bunny)Somtimes I sits and thinks and sometimes I just sits
Quinn25
Pokkel
moose
Vernonimous
Watte
niekie
Dante
Panther
Vetgesmeerde Blits
bryce_in_oz
Kozac
Blokkies
Number12_Lions
Brutus2
Lehe6
Estian Nortier
DavidS
johanleroux13
Morné
Tafelberg
pietstreak
Ollie
Koos
September 18th, 2012 at 1:56 pm
Why doesn’t Meyer give Lambie and Goosen some gametime?
Fuck, they are getting stiff on the bench.
September 18th, 2012 at 2:32 pm
Reply to biltongbek @ 1:56 pm:
Weird… I could have sworn the ‘greenhorn’ Goosen got some game time this last weekend…
September 18th, 2012 at 3:03 pm
Reply to bryce_in_oz @ 2:32 pm:
And I still have not heard much about Goosen’s 3 missed tackles out of his 4?
September 18th, 2012 at 3:16 pm
Reply to bryce_in_oz @ 2:32 pm: Uhuh.
He needs 80 minutes.
September 18th, 2012 at 3:18 pm
Reply to bryce_in_oz @ 3:03 pm: Still a better ratio than 4 misses out of 5 to goal.
September 18th, 2012 at 3:46 pm
Reply to biltongbek @ 3:18 pm:
That’s exactly why the Heineken Cup leading point’s scorer should have been taking the kicks…
September 18th, 2012 at 5:38 pm
Reply to bryce_in_oz @ 3:03 pm: Yip people forget that easy….I just think HM was part of Morne’s downfall, he should have give the kicking duties longtime to either Pienaar or Fransie, Morne could have then put all his effort in his general play which was not bad before the Championship.
As goalkicker I believe his form as the kicker playes a major roll in his general play as well.
September 18th, 2012 at 5:40 pm
The same bitching about Goosen was done in 2007 when Snor did not start Morne in teh Lions test and only filter him in the team at that stage.
September 18th, 2012 at 8:11 pm
It was 2009
September 18th, 2012 at 8:39 pm
Reply to DavidS @ 8:11 pm:
sorry 2009 but you get my point
September 18th, 2012 at 9:05 pm
Ja I exactly get your point.
Said it last night.
2005 with JW sticking to Jaco VD Westhuizen against all indications of kak form. Then when Andre Pretorius got released on the Aussies it was game over Aussies… with JDV 12 and JF 13.
Completely new 10/12/13 axis.
MS is deur sy coaches se gatte getrek… makes me ery annoyed that a potentially great player has perhaps been ruined and is subjected to unfair treatment by fans due to being ripped to pieces by poor coaches.
September 18th, 2012 at 10:49 pm
Morne had a good run in 2009 and 2010. As a goal kicker he was very good. He was never a world class flyhalf like Carter or Wilkinson though. His general play and defence was never good enough to be counted as one of the truly great flyhalves. His tactical kicking, although above average, does not set him appart from most other SA flyhalves either.
Morne was a good, solid Bok flyhalf and had some very good moments in the Bok yersey. He should return to playing Currie Cup until he finds form again, and then try and fight his way back into the Bok team. He is young enough to do so. I doubt that he will be able keep the younger, more talented flyhalves like Goosen and Jantjies at bay for too long.
Johan Goosen has all the attributes to be our own Dan Carter. On talent alone he is miles ahead of Steyn and should be developed into our Premier flyhalf.
I agree with Naas, Goosen is the best young flyhalf I have ever seen.
To those complaining about Goosens defence, he is a good, brave defender, Heyneke mentioned that he is probably too physical for a flyhalf. I wouldn’t be surprised if Goosen was ordered to not get involved in the rough stuff too much.
September 19th, 2012 at 1:32 am
Reply to bryce_in_oz @ 3:03 pm:
After reading your comment I went back to look for myself and what I saw was very disconcerting.
When Goosen came on, the score was 8-all. 10 seconds on the field and he lets Cory Jane run right past him. 8 Seconds later he can be seen running away from the gap that Smith takes to score the try.
It’s right here in this video, at the 15 and 23 second marks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4ensA5IvXo&feature=plcp
And then in the 78th minute there is this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaC9Qr2fHLA&feature=plcp
Stop the video at the 10 second markand what you’ll see is a perfectly set AB defence and a Bok attack in complete chaos.
That ball should have been kicked!
Instead he ran and passed, a penalty resulted and for the rest of the match, the ABs were on attack until the final 3-pointer that denied the Bok the bonus point.
This is our great hope at 10?
Let us rather hope they can teach him to defend and use his brain in short order.
September 19th, 2012 at 7:53 am
Talking of Currie Cup, I see Jebb has not had any further sacntions due to the fact that Deysel hit him 5 times with a flat hand: From Beeld:
“’n Tugkomitee van Saru, onder voorsitterskap van Peter Ingwersen, het Sinclair kwytgeskeld op grond daarvan dat die teenstander wat hy platgeslaan het, Jean Deysel, hom vyf keer met die plathand bygekom het.”
Why has Deysel not been sighted then?
September 19th, 2012 at 7:56 am
Reply to Craven @ 7:53 am: Good to know the retaliation is forgiven if you have been hit 5 times or mre.
We should communicate this to everyone, don’t hit a guy 5 times, only 4 or less.
September 19th, 2012 at 8:05 am
Reply to Craven @ 7:53 am: For a long time now I felt that players who prevoke other players should get cited. This is becomming a sick part of the game were players are getting hold back slapped and pushed while refs do nothing.
Please do not get me wrong, both WP players should have been banned for 6 weeks for this, I hate players making rugby a place for a boxing match, but Deysel started pulkling the dude around the neck and end up 40 seconds later slapping him in the face, who would just stand their and wait for useless refs to do something.
AB are using this way of play for years now, so I do feel players like Deysel should be cited
September 19th, 2012 at 8:09 am
Reply to Jacques(Bunny)Morne Steyn is Baas @ 8:05 am: I agree.
September 19th, 2012 at 10:41 am
Reply to Jacques(Bunny)Morne Steyn is Baas @ 8:05 am:
For a long time now I felt that players who prevoke other players should get cited.
———
Ah, I remember it well. Kwas were playing
Lions(?) in Kimberley.
Ref blows, calls a player, tells him:
“Ek wil jou net waarsku: As iemand vandag
aan jou slaan, stuur ek vir jóú af.”
Ref was André Watson.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:21 am
Blits
No other flyhalf in the history of union has ever scored 30 points against the All Blacks in a test…
Not Wilkinson
Not Botha
Not Lynagh
Not John
NOT ONE
Morne Steyn did.
If you think that is not the sign of a unique and special player then fuck knows what you think makes a player special…
Go back and watch the 2009 Tri-Nations and see Steyn at the very top of his game dictate play, run froma shallow attack, kick perfectly, control some superb backline set piece tries for the Boks interplaying with FDP, JF and Habana especially. And his defence was then and still is outstanding compared to Goosen who cannot tackle (or rather is slightly better than Lambie)… MS channel is a closed door and has been since 2009.
Timeo is right
I still do not see the Goosen hype. As I said for me the telling thing was the way Elton Jantjes owned him in the SR season opener…
September 19th, 2012 at 11:23 am
Just on average, Steyn is the fastest scoring flyhalf in 3N history and SA history and SR…
THAT is NOT average.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:33 am
Reply to DavidS @ 11:23 am:
The fact that we have played a type of game that aims to milk penalties as our primary way of accumalating points the past two years might add to the fact that our kicker scores a lot of points?
September 19th, 2012 at 11:34 am
PS. I am not refuting the fact that it is quite an achievement.
September 19th, 2012 at 12:36 pm
Reply to DavidS @ 11:21 am:
A flyhalf can only score as much points as his team allows him to do. Did he create the penalty opportunities or score all the tries in that test to set up conversion opportunities?
No
Any acurate goal kicker could have scored those points on that day, I don’t know this suddenly makes him better than Botha, Lynagh or Wilkinson, because he is, and never was even close to their class.
Sure he has been accurate in the tri nations, but it is the team that creates penalty opportunities for the kicker. Would Braam van Straaten or Louis Koen have scored much less given those opportunities? Very likely. The amount of points a flyhalf scores is not a yardstick for his quality, it is his accuracy. And admittedly Morne was very accurate during that time. He is woefull in this regard in the moment an must go, it is as simple as that.
If you use this flawed argument then surely Marius Joubert is the best centre of all time, heck he scored a hat trick of tries agains the All Blacks. Danie Gerber has nothing on him.
And to say channel is a closed door and has been since 2009 is probably the dumbest thing said on here all week.
I like Morne Steyn, he has been good to the Boks at times. But he was and will never be close to the best flyhalves in the world like Carter and Wilkinson.
Goosen has the talent to be the best. He is not the finished article yet, but Heyneke would not have fast tracked him if he didn’t think he was very special.
September 19th, 2012 at 12:37 pm
Very unlikely
September 19th, 2012 at 12:38 pm
Morne’s
September 19th, 2012 at 12:43 pm
And all the proven wrong Morne fans on here can stop trying to discredit Goosen, it will not make the 2012 version of Morne any less woeful. Morne’s performance on Saturday was one of the worst performances by a Bok flyhalf I have ever seen.
Like I said before, If he regains form again he could still push for the Bok position. He is still young enough. But he is letting his team down at the moment and needs to get back to his best before being considered again.
September 19th, 2012 at 1:00 pm
Reply to Craven @ 11:34 am: I can cleaely remember that we scored the past few years alot from first and second phase.
Tries in 2010
Wallabies 17
All Blacks 22
Springboks 13
In 2010:
For the Wallabies 26% of their remaining tries were from possessions that commenced within 10 metres of the try line, 29% within 10 to 20 metres of the try line and the balance 11% started between 20 and 50 metres from the try line.
For the All Blacks only 9% of their remaining tries were from possessions that commenced within 10 metres of the try line, 18% within 10 to 20 metres of the try line and the balance 14% started between 20 and 50 metres from the try line.
For the Springboks 38% of their remaining tries were from possessions that commenced within 10 metres of the try line, 31% within 10 to 20 metres of the try line and the balance 16% started between 20 and 50 metres from the try line.
From 2009 to 2012 in Tri Nations Springboks score 32 tries
All Blacks score 50 tries
Australia scored 41 tries
Each team has won the championship once in the past three years, Boks in 2009, AB in 2010 and Australia in 2011
Australia has a 40 % win in the past three years
Nz has a 75 % win in the past three years
South Africa has a 42.5 % win in the last three years
NZ has dominated the Rugby world in the past few years and our win record in Tri Nations up to this year is more than Australia with our so called kick and search methods.
We getting exited too soo too many times when it gets to Bok rugby, and one thing I can not understand…..when HM took over everyone was on seven heaven about his appointment and we knew what style he will start of with with what players and now we are premature in judging the coach.
GIVE THE FREAKING GUY A CHANGE TO SORT OUT THE HOUSE. Bitching about what every blogger see which player should be in the team is
.
I also do not like all ythe players HM or bloggers think is god’s give to mankind but the way people and so called experts are going on is getting boring and stupid.
If you do not want to give a chap a change with all the shit he have with injured players and structures then I do not know anymore.
We all know the reason why Morne was so successful the past few years was that we always had a pack that was given backline proper ball, I can only remember the first test against England and AB were our forwards played to what we used to.
I can not remember when HM had a change to pick the same pack two games in a row yet this year and we all know that some of his first choice players is not yet fit or still injured.
Soos die gesegde gaan:” Hou jou foken Panties aan asb!!!!”
Ek is nogsteeds opgewonde oor HM en wat hy met die Span gaan doen.
September 19th, 2012 at 1:22 pm
Reply to Jacques(Bunny)Morne Steyn is Baas @ 1:00 pm:
Relax, you’ll have a heart attack if you go on like that.
What I was trying to explain is that there might be other reasons contributing to the fact that Morne scored so many points in such a short space of time, nothing more nothing less.
Why on earth would you now fly into a full-on defence of Heyneke and his team?
September 19th, 2012 at 1:43 pm
Reply to Craven @ 1:22 pm: not pointing at you craven I just cannot understand this whole hesteria going on on all forums and blogs at this stage
September 19th, 2012 at 3:00 pm
Reply to Timeo @ 1:32 am:
Timeo, that’s a bit harsh. On the Jane tackle, his inside defense was supposed to and did make it. Goosen was watching his channel and reacted to Jane stepping in but it wasn’t his tackle to make.
On the creation of the gap, he looked to o to a specific position, the AB’s should be applauded for seeing at using the opportunity that it created.
Regarding the kick, have you looked at how many times that that exact scenario has been played by a myriad of other top teams, the AB’s included. It’s called sucking in defence out wide and creating phase play. The fact that the ball was not protected is not a Goosen issue.
I think you are being hard on him considering the circumstances.
September 19th, 2012 at 3:39 pm
Reply to Ollie @ 3:00 pm: Agree 100%
Some guys here are using different criteria when they are judging Goosen and Morne.
Like I said before, don’t try and discredit Goosen because you have been proven wrong in backing the 2012 version of Morne Steyn.
September 19th, 2012 at 4:22 pm
Reply to Vetgesmeerde Blits @ 12:36 pm:
September 19th, 2012 at 5:12 pm
Reply to Ollie @ 3:00 pm:
I think not. Jane was his. He did not move on to the next player, he simply stepped slightly outside of Jane. Jane was tackled yes, but it used up another 2 defenders.
Next to a ruck, if a deficiency out wide is spotted, the normal practice is to call in players from the other side and shift, that way the close channel stay protected. He ran out past two other players to find a spot out wide and left the gap for Smith. You may use the new player inexperience excuse but it does not remove the fact that the gap was created by his actions.
The last play.
In no way was the scattering of Bok forwards out wide deliberate, it was utter chaos. To keep the play alive, he could have taken it to the line himself, close to support. Or kick as a safe option to protect the bonus point the Boks had at that point. Running and passing wide was a choice of brawn over brain.
Reply to Vetgesmeerde Blits @ 3:39 pm:
I specifically left Steyn out of my post because as far as I’m concerned he is out. Goosen should be the starter now. I fully agree with that. I fully agree that he is a great talent. It is however, of no use to overlook the mistakes he made and if not attended to will make again. Trying to discredit my observations by pointing to me being a Morne fan does not erase that.
September 19th, 2012 at 8:56 pm
It really doesn’t matter whether some want to discredit Goosen or some want to discredit steyn.
These are the facts, in the last 7 tests Morne has had a kicking accuracy of 59.5%.
no matter how you want to slice it that is simply unacceptable at international level.
Yes Morne plays to a gameplan that works for 80% of the time for most teams.
However, and once again this is the reality, Morne stands too deep to attack the gainline, every time he kept ball in hand he hesitated and eas caught in possession behind the advantage line.
He might not be at the end of his Bok career, but he is not in form.
Whether you are a Bulls supporter, a Morne supporter or not, stand back and ask yourself whether that is good enough and if Morne came from another Province, what would your call be.
Simple.
September 19th, 2012 at 10:38 pm
So HM has 3 options:
1. Morne Steyn (most likely)
2. Johan Goosen
3. Elton Jantjies
September 20th, 2012 at 1:37 am
Reply to Boertjie @ 10:38 pm:
To me it’s pretty simple.
Goosen to start, and there are enough utility backs and place kickers in the team to have no need for Steyn in the match 22 either.
Release him to play CC or keep him in the Bok setup does not really matter. Whatever they deem most likely to get him back to form.
I doubt Jantjies is test rugby material. I can’t recall him ever making much of an impact in an SR game. If the Sharks play Lambie at 10 next year, he might lay a claim also.